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	<title>Comments on: Intalio: the Open Source BPMS Leader?</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.vosibilities.com/bpel-bpm-bpmn-software/intalio-the-open-source-bpm-leader/2008/04/03/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.vosibilities.com/bpel-bpm-bpmn-cep-soa-software/intalio-the-open-source-bpm-leader/2008/04/03/</link>
	<description>The ActiveVOS blog and podcast for SOA and Java developers</description>
	<pubDate>Sat, 22 Nov 2008 04:04:27 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: Intalio open source BPM suite &#124; Some Java, J2EE and WebSphere stuffs</title>
		<link>http://www.vosibilities.com/bpel-bpm-bpmn-cep-soa-software/intalio-the-open-source-bpm-leader/2008/04/03/#comment-20</link>
		<dc:creator>Intalio open source BPM suite &#124; Some Java, J2EE and WebSphere stuffs</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 15 May 2008 18:15:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.vosibilities.com/soa-application-development-with-visual-orchestration-systems/intalio-the-open-source-bpm-leader/2008/04/03/#comment-20</guid>
		<description>[...] I read a post by Alex Neihaus about Intalio&#8217;s open source code . He is not able to see even a single line of source code in [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] I read a post by Alex Neihaus about Intalio&#8217;s open source code . He is not able to see even a single line of source code in [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Alex Neihaus</title>
		<link>http://www.vosibilities.com/bpel-bpm-bpmn-cep-soa-software/intalio-the-open-source-bpm-leader/2008/04/03/#comment-12</link>
		<dc:creator>Alex Neihaus</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 04 Apr 2008 14:20:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.vosibilities.com/soa-application-development-with-visual-orchestration-systems/intalio-the-open-source-bpm-leader/2008/04/03/#comment-12</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Ismael, &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;The fact that you can get source somewhere else is irrelevant, and I think you know it. It's not so much the availability of source that we take issue with, it's the head-fake you are giving potential customers about being &#34;open source&#34; for your core product, which you clearly are &lt;em&gt;not&lt;/em&gt;. &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;At a strategic marketing level, you have apparently decided that being associated with open source is desirable. So, you've inappropriately co-opted open source branding for your product based on your own, unique, non-standard definition. It's a lot like wearing leather to an environmental rally you drove to in a Hummer. Apparently, you hope that once you mix in with the crowd, they might not notice what you arrived in and they'll accept your &lt;em&gt;bona fides&lt;/em&gt;.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;After I wrote this post, I was flooded with input from others who have also taken issue with the fact that you label your proprietary system as &#34;open source.&#34; Your company has used essentially the same defense to my post &lt;a href="http://speeves.erikin.com/2008/03/intalio-not-open-source.html" target="_blank" rel="nofollow"&gt;here&lt;/a&gt; and has been dinged as far back as &lt;a href="http://blogs.jboss.com/blog/tbaeyens/2006/11/29/What_is_open_source_Intalio_sure_is_NOT.txt" target="_blank" rel="nofollow"&gt;2006&lt;/a&gt; for what that blogger describes as &#34;cheap insinuations&#34; of being open source.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;I can only surmise this &lt;em&gt;1984&lt;/em&gt;-like doublespeak is, and has been, deliberate. Your &lt;a href="http://www.intalio.com/company/open-source/" target="_blank" rel="nofollow"&gt;web site&lt;/a&gt; continues to misquote Gartner, claiming you are the only &#34;first and only credible Open Source BPMS&#34; when in fact, &lt;em&gt;the very link you quote as a source&lt;/em&gt; labels you, at best, &#34;open-source-like.&#34; It's amazing to me that the authors of this report haven't called you out for misusing it for so long.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt; I do admire the &lt;em&gt;chutzpah&lt;/em&gt; it takes to call black white.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ismael, </p>
<p>The fact that you can get source somewhere else is irrelevant, and I think you know it. It&#8217;s not so much the availability of source that we take issue with, it&#8217;s the head-fake you are giving potential customers about being &quot;open source&quot; for your core product, which you clearly are <em>not</em>. </p>
<p>At a strategic marketing level, you have apparently decided that being associated with open source is desirable. So, you&#8217;ve inappropriately co-opted open source branding for your product based on your own, unique, non-standard definition. It&#8217;s a lot like wearing leather to an environmental rally you drove to in a Hummer. Apparently, you hope that once you mix in with the crowd, they might not notice what you arrived in and they&#8217;ll accept your <em>bona fides</em>.</p>
<p>After I wrote this post, I was flooded with input from others who have also taken issue with the fact that you label your proprietary system as &quot;open source.&quot; Your company has used essentially the same defense to my post <a href="http://speeves.erikin.com/2008/03/intalio-not-open-source.html" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">here</a> and has been dinged as far back as <a href="http://blogs.jboss.com/blog/tbaeyens/2006/11/29/What_is_open_source_Intalio_sure_is_NOT.txt" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">2006</a> for what that blogger describes as &quot;cheap insinuations&quot; of being open source.</p>
<p>I can only surmise this <em>1984</em>-like doublespeak is, and has been, deliberate. Your <a href="http://www.intalio.com/company/open-source/" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">web site</a> continues to misquote Gartner, claiming you are the only &quot;first and only credible Open Source BPMS&quot; when in fact, <em>the very link you quote as a source</em> labels you, at best, &quot;open-source-like.&quot; It&#8217;s amazing to me that the authors of this report haven&#8217;t called you out for misusing it for so long.</p>
<p> I do admire the <em>chutzpah</em> it takes to call black white.</p>
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		<title>By: ghalimi</title>
		<link>http://www.vosibilities.com/bpel-bpm-bpmn-cep-soa-software/intalio-the-open-source-bpm-leader/2008/04/03/#comment-11</link>
		<dc:creator>ghalimi</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 03 Apr 2008 20:19:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.vosibilities.com/soa-application-development-with-visual-orchestration-systems/intalio-the-open-source-bpm-leader/2008/04/03/#comment-11</guid>
		<description>Alex,

100% of the code that goes into the runtime components of Intalio&#124;BPMS Community Edition is licensed under the Apache Public License. These are essentially the Apache ODE BPEL engine and the Tempo Workflow framework, plus a lot of existing open source components, such as Apache Tomcat and the Orbeon XForms engine. I doubt that anyone interested in modifying the code of Intalio&#124;BPMS Community Edition would have any difficulty putting these pieces together. Nevertheless, we'd be happy to create a build for you if you want.

Best regards
Ismael Ghalimi, CEO
Intalio, Inc.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Alex,</p>
<p>100% of the code that goes into the runtime components of Intalio|BPMS Community Edition is licensed under the Apache Public License. These are essentially the Apache ODE BPEL engine and the Tempo Workflow framework, plus a lot of existing open source components, such as Apache Tomcat and the Orbeon XForms engine. I doubt that anyone interested in modifying the code of Intalio|BPMS Community Edition would have any difficulty putting these pieces together. Nevertheless, we&#8217;d be happy to create a build for you if you want.</p>
<p>Best regards<br />
Ismael Ghalimi, CEO<br />
Intalio, Inc.</p>
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